sadiq naveed
Forum Senior
Topics: 31
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i hav got three options for usce.i will tell u about them one by one
psychiatry externship
its at a distance of like one and half hr from here.so i will hav to shift in area.can odd job with less hrs.living expanses will be like 1200 dollars per month.its totally volunteer for one month.as for its type is considered its high rated type but speciality is not of my interest
research in anesthesia
its at a distance of like 30 mins from here whr i am living .its 15-20 hrs per week.can do odd job with more hrs,can cover ny expanses.but it will be totally volunteer.they will consider best performer for some stipend after 3 months.i can cover my expanses easily with odd job
research in internal medicine
specilaity is of my interest.they will be doing a contract of one yr .for first 6 month will hav to do volunteer work and for next month will pay me 3000 dollars/month.living expanses r like 800-900 dollars per month.i will hav to shift thr.the person with whom i will be working is associate prof in medicine and can easily get me in residency next yr if he wish to do so.can do some odd job and cover some of expanses but for six month i will hav to ask for money from home and for next six month university will be paying@ 3000 dollars per month
so far as i hav devised my priority
research in anesthesia....no 1
research in internal medicine...no 2
psychiatry externship
now wht do u say.know
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| angel^Doctor
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which specialty are you going for ?
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| Justice
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I am just curious: how research can be USCE?
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| vanshita
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what i think is while working wiith physician in his/her research he/she allow you to come to their clinic so, they may be consider as USCE
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| sadiq naveed
Forum Senior
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ok leave for a while tht whether research is usce or not...just advice me wht to do
i wana enter in medicine or paeds residency programme
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| Justice
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sadiq naveed wrote:
ok leave for a while tht whether research is usce or not...just advice me wht to do
My sincere advice: take psychiatry externship... Research (even involving patient samples) will never be regarded as USCE... If it was, then I am in the clinic for ~6 years...
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| yogesh
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if i were in your place, I'd select research in IM if I had stellar scores and i am aiming for top Uni prog in IM.
But if my score are average and I am aiming for "ANY PROG" in IM, externship in psych is also not a bad choice. (So many programs have USCE as requirement and you'll be eligible for much more number of programs). Community programs seems to give preference to USCE compared to research..
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| nyimalay
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I agree with Yogesh.
I think for any IM program, someone who did IM related research will be favored over one who did Psychiatry externship.
Just my thoughts.
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| njcjzy
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Research is definitely not USCE. But if as you said, the physician you will be working for will help you get into his department as a residency (even though, I don't think anyone can gurantee on that), I would say research at IM would be fine. I know an IMG who worked as a researcher for a whole year was matched in the IM department she worked at. She had nice scores, published four papers, could speak Spanish and English fluently, worked for the chief of division of cardiology. And the IM program she entered was top notch in the states.
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| sadiq naveed
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thanks alot everyone
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| hitesh
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I agree with yogesh, njcj,, I once had an opportunity to talk with a program director of a university program.. and believe me, they totally dig research experience.. They'd literally drool if you had one year of research experience in IM besides other credentials.. Ofc, community programs dont care about research a lot and psychiatry externship will be a better choice if you're targetting some community hospitals..
But, my advice would be to go for the IM research. Take loans to support yourself for the first 6 months and pay back during the next 6.. 
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| Anamgarcia
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My advice... Dont get stuck in research. It is not worth the trouble and will not guarantee anything as oposed to an estelar exetrnship in anything, even psych
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| Moozy
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I would suggest IM research. It sounds that u like the specialty, they can get you into a resideny if they want.. and even if they cant.. u still have research exp for 1 year. That is the perfect combo if you have average scores.
I have asked my PD in past (as my other half wil be applying in coming september). He said he does not consider onserverships as USCE as it is not hands on exp.. and infact observerships are a put off for him as the letter will not have any weight as he knows what capacity an observer works in. On the other hand he favours research a lot. Few people have gotten into resideny that I personally know after doing 1 year research.. they were old grads and had avergae scores.
so in my view; research in IM should be no-1, then anesthesia. if nothing works out then Psych should be the last option.
sadiq naveed wrote:
ok leave for a while tht whether research is usce or not...just advice me wht to do
i wana enter in medicine or paeds residency programme
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| hitesh
Forum Senior
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And let me just add another benifit of going for research.
1 yr of research will significantly increase your chances of getting a fellowship later on ( that is if you're interested in doing one) . And when it comes to fellowships, they ALL just looove research experience
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| Justice
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Moozy wrote:
I have asked my PD in past ... He said he does not consider onserverships as USCE as it is not hands on exp.. and infact observerships are a put off for him...
This could be true only if your program does not run observerships... I spent 5.5 years doing cancer immunology research in terrific US university and publishing papers in top-notch immunology/cancer research journals, and PDs of several programs told me that this kind of experience favors me over those who have no research experience at all but has no role when I am compared to those who have USCE...
I enter the observership on Monday, and I am already overloaded with stuff to learn beginning by how to connect and navigate the UCONNECT patient record system through knowing their histories and finishing by presenting patients to attending on the first day... You won't do too much of hands on exam anyway for those who are on ward for several day... This happens only when the patient is being admitted...
My wife is also asked to do observership in pathology in order to be considered as a good applicant for pathology residency... Pathology observership does not involve any hand work except trimming samples/making smears...
And, how much of success could one gain in research over a short period of time? If it won't result in a good paper, it will be more than useless unless it helps to establish good connections...
To author of this topic: ultimately your records will show that you know who to deal with patients in a setting of US hospital... That is what you need...
Edited by Justice on 04/26/08 - 11:13 AM
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| Moozy
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May be you are right. It can vary from PD to PD.
My hospital does have observerships though.. for one month only. But believe me my observer's are only allowed to take history under supervision of intern. they cannot do anything else. It als depends on how proactive one wants to be.. but at the max they can present a case may be once in a week. We have med students and Sub- I.. they are the ones in whom attendings are more interested in.. like discussing papers and presenting cases with differentials. Also, I can confirm this that OBSERVERSHIP in medicine is NOT counted as USCE.
EXTERNSHIP is counted as USCE. (bcos u need temp license for externship and can actually touch pts).
I ahve been through interview process last year and most hospitals in north east (considered FMG friendly), clearly state in their selection process that they like hands on CE.. not observership. Observership does give you an edge in the sense that if you have never worked in western system before, it is a good experience. Also, it allows you to be seen by faculty.
Good Luck with ur choices.
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| sadiq naveed
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thanks alot guys
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| paheli
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Wow, this is a really good thread. I'll add my few cents here.
After spending a ridiculous amount of time looking for USCE, I've reached the conclusion that Externships [in ACGME-accredited hosps] are just not practical for FMGs. What I mean is, 99.9% of hosps do not offer it. So, where precisely is an IMG supposed to get it from? [I'm not even bringing into the picture those doubtful companies that promise you hands-on for ~$5k.]
Also, do correct me if I'm wrong, but most people who matched successfylly last month did so after only Observing. PDs will certainly have their opinions of what their 'ideal' candidate should have, but with our extreme limitations, none of us IMGs have a decent chance of achieving those criteria. We should just concentrate on getting as close to that 'Ideal' as possible.
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| decide
Forum Senior
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The best option really depends on how much you are able to impress the people while you are working. I will go for research in internal medicine, its the speciality you like. You have the chance of getting in the program where you work.
As for observership being counted as USCE it really depends on what program. Observership isnt useless and people do get good lors from observerships not to mention their chance of getting into the program where they do an observership.
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| MDin08
Forum Junior
Topics: 14
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my opinion it's a 2 edged sword, either ones fine....as they say " beggers can't be choosers"....but if u r getting both...why don't u try to do both...well u have 1 year, start research & then after 2 mths when u have gained their trust just take 2 weeks off 7 go do observership....that way u'll have both...what could go worng with that....
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| Moozy
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good advice MD in 08
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| PGI2alpha
Forum Elite
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or may be you could do observership and research simulateously...3 days research and 3 days observership...see if tht works...
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