lost07now08
Forum Newbie
Topics: 3
Posts: 15
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85 step 1(1st attempt) 84 step 2 ck (1 st attempt) CS passed(second attempt ) waiting for step 3 result,visa required(j1 or H1B),2 months observership in emergency medicine,2 months in internal medicine,2 months research experience,6 US LOR's ,everything after i applied i did,will be doing another 1 month of research with 3 months of externship before my next match.what r my chances for my next match??i applied to 205 programs(int med,fm,peds) this year with 3 interviews and did not match.any advice
I am depressed as I have spent so much money and I do understand many are in my simillar position,but its hard for me to fight with my family supporting me,and i come form a middle class family .
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| bbb
IM Program Coordinator
Topics: 33
Posts: 5,091
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Can you still fight? I don't know - can't you?
You can still fight, but can you?
___________________
bbb - trying to combine common sense and humour into realistic answers, but not going to guess on anyone's chances of getting into a position....
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| royalgeorge
Forum Elite
Topics: 10
Posts: 266
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Get ur personal statement read by some doctor, see ur cv for gaps.
Is ur interview skills good, and try to do observership a some place where they also have residency programs.
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| lost07now08
Forum Newbie
Topics: 3
Posts: 15
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i can fight , for one last time .anybody with my credentials have got thro residency this year??all i heard is about 99 and 95 plus people who got matched , anybody in my boat who got thro this ??
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| ngt
Forum Guru
Topics: 34
Posts: 304
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i would add: do you know what is written in your LORs? have some American MD read it and tell you what they think. ngt.
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| minang
Forum Senior
Topics: 3
Posts: 229
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Make good connections during your observerships with key people there. Make a good impression and show that you are eager to learn and you are a team player. Make them feel that having you in their residency program will enrich the program. Interpersonal skills are important.
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| wamba
Forum Guru
Topics: 148
Posts: 660
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You got 3 interviews. One is enough to match. What went wrong? stress your interview skills. As bbb always says, when they call you it means they think you know the medical part of the business. At the interview, you have to show them that you can work, suffer, breath, sweat and laugh together. This is the most important thing at interview. My personal case is emblematic. I attended 2 interviews in 48hours and got 2 prematches the same days. And in my interview days many candidates had better credentials than me. My advice: present your residency as part of a life plan, a brilliant project you've been working in all these years. Show them that you are goal oriented; that you dont just come to the US because of the american dream or because it is the 1 power in the world. Show them that you have a project and with confidence and humility DEMONSTRATE them that the programs goals fit in with it. If you do that, I can guarantee you that you will have very very very high chance to get a position.
Why am I that sure? This is my first experience with the match. The feeling I got about this process is the majority of the candidates attend the interviews not properly prepared. I know closely about 30 people who attended the interviews. very smart people, some with great scores.
1. some of them forgot to develop their strength. if you have a great clinical experience; if you have intubated, placed central lines, etc. how can you forget to mention it in your PS, in your CV and during the interview? if you know something, tell it in detail somewhere in your application;
2. Some other did not find a great explanation of their weaknesses. But when you do that, weakness becomes a strength. you have many months to meditate you weakness. do it.
3. many do not have a project. medicine and residency must be part of a lifetime project that can fit in with the programs goal. most interviewers will ask you "why did you come to America/this program?" Find a smart answer; one that is different from the mass. you dont have 99/99 so you have to be more interesting as a person.
4. when they ask you tell me about yourself, tell me about your country, or any other question that does not seem medical, remember that you are attending a medical interview. all the answer but enhance your MEDICAL AND PERSONAL STRENGTH and your ability to fit in with the program. exemple: tell me about your homeland? you can talk about the health situation and the problems you are facing and from then you orientate the comments on you. on what you have done, in details or on what you are able or going to do. Focus on you and on your skills. dont waste time talking about tourism or other useless thing. you are not at a party. it is job. dont be fouled by these questions.
5. try to keep calm anytime. Remember, only to death there is no remedy.
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| mvat
Forum Junior
Topics: 1
Posts: 84
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1. You have alot of observerships and research experience which is great, but do you think the amount of time is enough? 2-3 months here and there? I'm really not sure about this okay, but do you think if you stay at one place for up to 6 months this would look better. Ask around and get other people's opinions about this. Observership is great but try to get into something that may be more hands on...like research with the opportunity to do observership at the same time/place. Try to do something that will be in your field of interest.
2. You failed CS the first time. Why? Does this mean that your english skills need improvement? Try working on your interview skills. Having been through this already, you know 50% of the questions so practice practice. But be yourself, they can tell if you are rehearsed.
3. When did you apply. Early makes a huge difference. Despite what others will tell you, mid-late sept is too late. Sure you will get interviews, but you problably lost at least 1+. Your ENTIRE application should be ready and scanned well before september 1.
4. Make yourself stand out somehow. You have alot of experience but i'm sure others do too.
5. With your scores it is possible to match. Scores mean alot but they are not everything. I know someone with lower scores than you but got 3 times more interviews. This person did have more experience though. So i'm thinking that he got matched because of the experience factor. So you see, scores aren't everything.
6. Review your application and all the things that you did this past year. If you could have done anything better then do it next time. If you could have applied 3 days earlier then do it.
Good luck
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| bbb
IM Program Coordinator
Topics: 33
Posts: 5,091
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mvat wrote:
2. You failed CS the first time. Why? Does this mean that your english skills need improvement? Try working on your interview skills. Having been through this already, you know 50% of the questions so practice practice. But be yourself, they can tell if you are rehearsed.
This is so true - we call them canned answers and the PD will send me in to access language. If they can't hold a conversation with me, we know that there is a language problem....
___________________
bbb - trying to combine common sense and humour into realistic answers, but not going to guess on anyone's chances of getting into a position....
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| Tikis
Forum Newbie
Topics: 0
Posts: 3
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You have a good chance of matching this year. I am one of those who did not match but did have high scores 97/99/Passed. I did have only 3 interviews however. I believe the main reason for this is because even though I applied early I did so only with 2 scores and 2 LoR and even without a MPSE. I interviewed well, I know this because of the feedback I recieved from 1 program. They were very interested in me from the interviews. What I think did me in was the fact that in the I got my step 2 CS in February and by that time I guess they must have already made up their mind that they were not going to risk it. I also wanted an H1 visa and tried to negotiate this using my credentials and surprisingly the programs were not quite willing to give me this since my step 3 was not available.
From my experience this is what you should do.
1. Take a break and kick out this wave of doubt and depression.
2. Pull in your resources together. Get all LoR ready, MPSE, get your personal statements read if possible by some of the doctors you have worked with.
3. Have all your documents scanned and ready in august.
4. On the 1st of September apply completely. The early bird catches the worm my friend. You have good credentials so prepare well. This strategy will secure you as many interviews as you can. Once you have them your probability of being matched increases with each one of them.
5. Prepare well for your interview. Honestly I don't think it really is a problem, unless you don't know how to be yourself, have a good smile, know what you want, show that you are willing to learn, know your limitations and are really hardworking. They are not looking for geniuses man. They just want someone who is going to contribute to their program and benefit from the training they have to offer and not kill their patients.
6. Lastly do not trust too much what most of the program directors tell you. If they don't offer you a prematch do not assume they are so very interested in you. I guess in part this was my mistake too. Remember that the application process is like a hide and seek game between you and the program directors. They also hate the scramble more than you do. They make all their candidates feel like they are very interested in them on a personal level so you rank them high. In the same light you have to make them feel that you also are so interested in them but do exercise some caution because some of them won't even rank you.
Good luck and hope we make it next year.
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| falcon2007
Forum Senior
Topics: 16
Posts: 119
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lost07
sure you can mae it.
i apllied only for FM late oct, o 7 intervies and pre-matched. i had 85/88, so its possible with such scores.
good luck
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| vancomycin
Forum Elite
Topics: 73
Posts: 366
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i feel down,no energy
but after reading ur post,i start feling better
thx folks
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| lost07now08
Forum Newbie
Topics: 3
Posts: 15
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thank you wamba for your valuable advice ,as well as mvat and tikis and bbb,well the reason behind my CS failure was over confidence ,infact everybody who had written the letter said that this guy can mingle with anybody easily ,only those letters got me 2 interviews ,the other one i got it before i got those interviews,.anyway , after reading this post , u guys have given me some confidence , i m equally thankful to wamba,mvat,tikis and bbb,the only problem i have is financial issue ,and my family is stressed too cause of financial issue.
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| lost07now08
Forum Newbie
Topics: 3
Posts: 15
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The mistakes I did ,infact blunders
1)I applied on september 15th and my documents got scanned in the end of september i guess ,i applied to mostly univ and unvi affliated , never really went thro each program and took it easy before i could apply.
2)i assigned neurology personal statement for IM(thinking that neurology is fellowship) and my PS was definetly weak cause i showed how i struggled among the community i came from to this US,it was not related to studies it was more like my persoanl experience,then later i changed my PS from neurology to IM in late december
3)i assisgned only 2 lors (home country) in september thinking only i have to assign those speciality lors .
i never assisnged the USLORS cause i got those letters only in january middle to end.
4)I was good at my interview i m very sure abt it cause i came to know thro the resident there but the biggest mistake i showed my desperateness and got into the receving side after my interview , thats what the attending whom i knew told me.(this was only in one iv though i dont know what happened in other interview)
5)I applied to community programs only late in october .
WORST THING I ALLWAYS KEEP THINKING IS I HAVE LOW SCORES , CAUSE I WAS BEEN FRUSTRATED AND LOOKED DOWN BY THE 90+GUYS , INFACT I WAS HUMILIATED SAYING THAT I WONT GET ANYTHING FROM A GUY WHO GOT 90,EVENTHOUGH I DIDNT TAKE IT SERIOUSLY I WAS DISCOURAGED IN SO MANY PLACES WHICH MADE ME NOT TO COME TO ANY FORUMS.NOW ALSO I SEE MY SCORES DOWN.
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| lost07now08
Forum Newbie
Topics: 3
Posts: 15
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I got my first CS result on OCtober 15 where i failed and I had given the exam again and got my second CS result on december 6th,so i was ecfmg certified on december 13 th, this was another blunder ...now waiting for Step 3 result and getting tensed what if i fail and again my credentials will be in trouble.
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| kca
Forum Senior
Topics: 5
Posts: 159
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Don't listen to those people who discourage you. Good score means a better position, but it doesn't mean everything. You're still the important one. History proved that people with 80s got matched and 90s didn't get matched. It all depends on you. You have to feel confident with yourself, cause it's the key for your success. It will reflect on your interview and what you do. Those who looked down at you only give you negative effect, hurting you and your future... Keep in faith at yourself, that you can do it
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| lost07now08
Forum Newbie
Topics: 3
Posts: 15
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thanks kca
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| mvat
Forum Junior
Topics: 1
Posts: 84
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The good thing is that by next match you will have everything ready to go before sept. Consider revising your p.s. again. You want to be able to reflect some of your strengths. Be concise yet complete. I know...it's hard to do. I spent more than a month doing mine. I must have went through 15+ revisions. Have people read your p.s. it helps to get other peoples perspective because after going through it hour after hour everything just starts to blend together. It's good to have a personal touch to your p.s. but that can be done in 2 sentences (nothing cheesy though) It doesn't take a whole paragraph. Talking about what you've accomplished and gained is important. Don't just start listing things though because it doesn't draw in the reader and they can already see most of your accomplishments in your application. If you talk about something regarding your studies or accomplishments it should serve a purpose/get a point across. It shouldn't be... i did this and that and look how great I am. It should be closer to something like..what did you do, why, what did you get out of it, how will it help you towards your future residency. And, your ps should be geared towards the specialty you are applying to. When you get an interview a few questions will probably be generic but where do you think they will come up with the other questions to ask you? From your application and p.s. So maybe your p.s. should include something that you want them to talk to you about and something that you want them to know that they may not ask. These are just a few suggestions...it may not be the best way to approach things but it's just an idea i'm throwing out there.
For the financial issue I can't help you there. I know it's tough but you'll have to talk about it with your family to see what you're all willing to sacrafice. Start saving up now. Apply to lots and lots of programs. Its good to apply to some good ones but if you are financially limited then think twice about how many dream uni. you apply to. Harvard would be great but even amg's with better scores have a hard time getting in..you know what i mean. There's nothing wrong with comm. programs either. My thinking is that if you can afford it, apply to many (even the horrible ones) and then decide after your interviews if you are willing to train there. It's better to have options (even bad ones) rather than none at all.
Think about updating your LOR's so that it can reflect some of your recent accomplishments as well. or just update them so that they will have a more current date on them. Whatever you do, do it early. Late June may be a good time to ask, it gives them plenty of time to write one for you and plenty of time for you to have them scanned. But remember July-Aug. will be a busy season for eras so scanning can take up to 3 weeks.
Don't be desperate. I'm not sure about the whole asking if the program prematches. People have given alot of varying opinions on this. Some say they got one after they asked and some say they regretted asking. I guess it depends on the program and the circumstance/timing of asking. But the whole thing about calling them to ask if you made it on their ROL, i'm against it. What purpose does that serve other than to make you feel better. If you want to express your interest you can easily to that in a follow up letter and do it in a non-desparate way.
Now...here's the tough love....you're a doctor, a professional...so act like it. Be friendly, confident and intelligent (with humility of-course). Don't ask questions like what are my chances... they said they really enjoyed talking to me..does that mean they will rank me, the program dir. sent me a follow up letter..does that mean he will rank me..etc..Many of these questions really don't serve much of a purpose in terms of reaching your final goal..all it does is make you feel better or make you feel worse because you're driving yourself crazy trying to get some meaning out of their words. If i said i think you don't have a chance to match will you give up. No. If a program doesn't give you any signs of affirmation does that mean you shouldn't send them a thank you letter or give them affirmation of your interest. No. Save your energy towards improving yourself instead of wasting it on killing yourself inside. Ok, but just to get the whole thing out of your system...here's one last confidence booster...i think you have a great chance of matching. You'll probably get 3 interviews based on the fact that you got 3 this year, 3 more interviews just by applying early (to lots of programs), and 3 more by improving your application (experience, pers. statement, etc). 9 interviews...good job.
Good luck to you and your family. You seem like a nice guy.
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| friscan2b
Forum Guru
Topics: 86
Posts: 447
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Don't lose hope. I know how it feels, I've been there last year, too. It will happen for you, just keep at it, try to snap out of this mood and look ahead! Best of luck to you!
A.
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| wamba
Forum Guru
Topics: 148
Posts: 660
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Man, the support in this forum is incredible. If one had the same support in any aspect of his life it would be great.
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| appletree
Forum Newbie
Topics: 4
Posts: 22
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All the posts are so good that I had to burst into tears, because I had not reflected on what had happened right or wrong during my 4 interviews until just now.
1. I applied to 10 "bad" NY programs on Oct 23rd and 49 "random", almost all others in NY and NJ on Nov 7th. I got 3 ivs out of 10 "bad" ones, 1 iv out of 49 "random" ones.
So time and "quality" made big difference.
2. I have 90s scores with good US LORs, but old and without USCE!?
3. I was too foolish to trust a PD who told me many nice words in 3 emails; well, as what you all said: without a prematch offer=not really outstanding to deserve #1 position on the program's ROL.
Because of being lack of this commonsense, I gave up prematch offers (from "bad" programs, (now, I love those PDs in "bad" programs...)).
I understand that nice PD very well, but I just hate myself very much. It is not a regretful feeling. Just hate myself not to listen to the others' experience in this forum before.
4. I thought that I would accept any result of my Match calmly. But in fact, I was and am not ready for being unmatched.
Desperate and hopeless; well, it may be more abnormal if I felt happy about being unmatched...
Do not worry, all of us, unmatched people will be ourselves very soon esp. after the Scramble.
5. Nothing is perfect in the world.
A stronger background means a more wonderful and prospective Match of 2008! Let's work harder, unmatched guys!
Thank you very much, to those who guide and support the losers.
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| dis3
Forum Newbie
Topics: 2
Posts: 25
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Dear all,
after reading the posts in this forumI could'nt help posting this reply. Kudos to all the members who sepnd so much time and energy guiding applicants who need help....
Lost and other people who did not match and think that their scores are responsible...please read my creds:
step 1 :82 (second attempt)
Step 2:89 (First attempt)
CS (FISRT ATTEMPT)
sTEP 3: 82 (Fisrt attempt)...i gave after all my interviews in January 07.
Submitted my application by mid september
Masters in psych (US)
WORKING IN RESEARCH (3 YRS)
1 Publication, and did externship for 4-5 months.
Total No of IV: 13, ATTENDED 12 AND MATCHED!
Alright!
First of all, If I could match with these pathetic scores, I don't find any reason for others not to. The point is that I showed genuine interest in my field and tried to get as much experience as I could in US. us lor play a very imp role, and for anyone here to write a decent lor, u must spend atleast 4-6 months with them, and not just shadowing but taking initiative and having a practive approach.
secondly step 3 matters...irrespective of whether u need a visa or no, this way the Programs know that yes, u can practise medicine, and even if you failed one of the step, ur exam taking ability is not compromised. so if anyone of you (IMG) who did not give step 3 yet and is aiming for 2008, please give it asap.
oTHER THAN THIS HOW TO PREPARE FOR ivs etc, is very well covered in previous post, so don't find the need to repeat it.
Just be yourself and have faith in your abilities, cos if you don't believe in yourself, no one else will!
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| dis3
Forum Newbie
Topics: 2
Posts: 25
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Congratulations to all those who matched and Best wishes to those going for 2008 match. May God be with you all .....always!
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| acephil
Forum Newbie
Topics: 1
Posts: 9
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Hey BBB,
Do they send you in to "access" language or "assess" language? I guess not all of us share your mastery of the english language. Of course, when commenting on english proficiency, most of us would atleast check the spelling before making "asses" out of ourselves!
bbb wrote:
This is so true - we call them canned answers and the PD will send me in to access language. If they can't hold a conversation with me, we know that there is a language problem....
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| mufurc
Forum Elite
Topics: 13
Posts: 186
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Take it easy acephil and cut her some slack... Everyone makes a typo every once in a while... Even native speakers....
Try to make meaningful contributions to this forum....
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